The Problem with Bots

I can understand if a store has 1 or 2 bots, or "models", but the quantity shown in your photo, or greater, makes me more than suspicious.
Camping may certainly drive up traffic numbers as you say, but this differs in two important ways. First, it's out in the open. You know about it, I know about it and the Lindens know about it. Second, Camping is one user making their own choice TO camp. This collection of bots or mannequins looks to exist merely to pad numbers.
If an owner's place is so great, be it resort or store, why do they need to pad their numbers? Attract me with decor, attract me with good customer service or product, but not with blatant padding of your stats. My personal belief is that if your business lies to get me in – even in something simple like number of visitors – how do I know you don't lie about anything else? A slippery slope and one best avoided altogether.

BnT has a massive pile of them over his sim as well. Amazing someone exploiting SL for so much money and they has to go out of their way to make it worse.

I have noticed this lately. I have went to places with extremely high traffic numbers only to find no one at the location at all. Of course Lindens typically ignore these things until they are a huge problem.

Generally, when I go searching... I tend to ignore the places on top of the list with the ridiculous traffic numbers. I figure they're lying to me. Whether it's campers or bots doesn't really matter to me. The Lindens should just get rid of the traffic number in search. It's useless at this point.

Gawd! Who cares!! Get a life, people ... a "First Life."
Seriously, this is weird. Go outside you freaks!

The model bots at the shape stores not only serve an ethical purpose, but they are also a courtesy to the customers shopping for shapes. Alady also uses the bots. It makes it nice to see the shape on an avi, so that there is no guess work as to actual dimensions. It would also be a courtesy in clothings stores, to see the garments modeled on an actual avi. When bots are used as mannequins, as a courtesy to the customer, I don't see the problem. Holding a bunch of Ruths in a skybox serves no customer service or courtesy purposes.

Ban bots altogether, or limit the numbers that can be owned.
hmm...if these people are padding their numbers with bots, isn't that also padding the numbers for SL itself? The total number of accounts Linden happily points to could be off by a huuuge amount if this bot problem as described turns out to be just the tip of the iceberg. LOL I can foresee the entire SL world inhabited solely by bots all posing for each other.
And another thing, each of these bots get a nominal sum each month by Linden, right ( do they still give all the free accounts some small amount of Ls on a regular basis?)? Now some dude has 50,000 bots, at say 50-or-whatever- L free money a month... hmmm ...250,000 L per month...that's quite a nice bit of cash there. Just write some script for each bot that dumps his stipend into one main account.. sweeeet.

Of course Lindens ignore everything until it's a huge problem, they wouldn't be Linden's otherwise. The use of bots to boost traffic to an area is definitely wrong. As with any other business, you would suspect the Owners integrity in the services or goods that they do offer.

I suppose the use of Bots does have it purposes, such as in some SIMs they are used as targets for roleplaying activites such as Zombie Slaying. Now keeping in mind this is the only legitimate use I have ever seen for them to date, I am sure there are more out there. What has been described in this article falls pretty far from that example.

Instead of wasting time and money in SL, why not use those resources to make your RL more interesting? Is it just because it's easier? When you log off (or when the power goes out– haha), you're still the same boring you, no matter what you pretend to be online. As for the people who make real money off the deluded masses, more power to 'em! Nothing like a bunch of fools to facilitate the turning of a quick buck.

I came across something like a month ago in Instanbul City (sim now up for sale). The skybox the bots were in was built making it hard for one to just look through the wall inside. All the bots were inside a 20×20x20 sq meter area with 3 rows of 10×10x10 solid prims around the center. I was able to snap some pics without being ejected by having my camera distance set to max. Very strange thing to stumble upon for sure. As for owners using bots, I think one or two is fine if they're helping sell a product, but a skybox full of bots is cheating the numbers game it seems to me.

There's a difference between models, which are actually being used to display shapes, skins, clothing, and so on, and bots shoved in a box just to drive up traffic, although the net effect is similar. (Maybe SL (or some other bright creator) can offer a free "model" that resembles an avatar, and can be "dressed" in an owner's body parts and clothing, for display purposes?)

It's far too easy to just park a bot somewhere and leave them, with one of many different free anti-idle objects to keep them logged in. I've been guilty of it myself, leaving my avvie parked on a prize camp chair overnight to get something very nice. The problem is, with this becoming more widespread, all of these bots are using system resources that the rest of us could certainly use.

The only remedy I can see is having a puzzle of some kind pop up every length of time... eight, twelve hours, maybe, that would require a human response to stay online.

I can see the purpose of the "models", but SL Heaven knows that the bots you have been finding, along with the ejections from property seems more then fishy to me. As a resident who has been here almost 2 years (a toddler compared to many), I see no problem in the act of camping, just the camping for money which if one is not familiar, can be converted to real money. That to me is the bigger of two evils....bots to model/bring up traffic or bots/campers who get paid to be AFK (away from keyboard) all day? Either way, Linden Labs certainly has it's work cut out for em...in all aspects.

In my opinion a small number of bots should be allowed. Using bots as models or to do simple jobs like bar keeping, automated DJs and such should be allowed. However using large number of bots hidden away to boost traffic – or using several camping bots "earning" money from other mall owners should not be allowed.

If I remember correctly every household is allowed to up to 5 avatars, but if these bots are spawned from different IP addresses it would be difficult for Linden to distinguish real residents from fake ones.

My suggestion is that Linden change their policy to max 3 residents per physical person, while still allowing up to 5 connections from the same household. Combine this with age verification, and excessive use of bots will be impossible.

Do you people have jobs? You know there is this thing called personal interaction. It usually involves going outside, going to work, or just interacting with someone, as opposed to your computer screen. Try asking yourself how you have improved as a person after spending countless hours in front of the PC.

To "Getalife" and those who shout "Who cares! Get a Real Life!": SL is, arguably, a very valuable business/commerse platform still in its infancy, with profound potential for future use. There are difficulties that need to be addressed and overcome as with any new innovation. IMO, SLers care because they believe in the technology and it's possiblities.
To you scoffers I say It's not a game, there is real-life *ch-CHINNG* MONEY to be made with this tool, if you can position yourself well, either by luck or by experience & skill.

There is a reason places are put on the "popular" list and bots defeat this purpose. Some stores/activities next to places with bots are very hard to move in due to the great lag caused by bots. There are legitimate businesses on SL that suffer due to bots. There are no positive reasons for bots other then deceiving people. Bots should not be allowed at all in SL.

Hi, i'd like to let you know that many sections of this page, are now illegal according to the new copyright laws of Second Life. you must call it Linden lab, not linden labs, and all references to Linden lab and second life must have the appropriate trademark symbol.
You have 90 days to comply.
http://secondlife.com/corporate/brand/trademark/

These bots have been there for ages! Look on SL and SLEX forums, people mention them dating back a very long time. Its really sad though that people use bots to inflate traffic.

There are places on the popular list though that do not use bots. "Freebie Beach" is one of them, they have a lot of freebies for people to use and test out which is how they get lots of real traffic. I think in their case they make their money by using metaRL.com, so instead of selling people thinks they just use those metaRL affiliate machines.

So real traffic can still get you on the pop list!

Get a life, people!!!!!!

I don't see a problem with the bots. I see a problem with how stores are ranked in Search.

To all those who say "go out and get a life", how come all YOU are doing is sitting in front of a computer screen, reading these blogs, and taking the time and trouble to post a reply????

Second Life is a brilliant learning tool, and confidence builder, and for some people who are unable to leave the house because of physical disabilities it can be a real boon for them just to spend a couple of hours a day interacting with people from all over the world while improving skills.

On the subject of bots, these are a real problem, and this has been by far the best article I have read on the subject. Linden are not going to stop the use of bots because, at this time, bots do count as traffic, and do make their figures in Real World look fantastic when compared to other virtual worlds.

But SL is not really a game, I believe – it is more of a social experiment – and Linden Labs are currently enjoying the controversy caused by bots. There does seem to be a definite split between bot owners and bot haters.

Alady Island is the only skin store I know who use their bots in a fair and honest way. The owner, Tracey Sassoon, has the bots demonstrating her wonderful collection of skins and shapes, and clearly shows these be be demonstration bots. Each bot has been given an appropriate bot-like name, and there is floating text also stating clearly they are bots. I wish more SIM owners were like her, because she is a very fair and honest human being, and does a lot for the users of Second Life.

Vogue, on the other hand, has demo bots on the ground floor sales area, but never any customers when I go there, but many bots secreted away in skyboxes. Platinum Skins is another skin mall, that has a few customer, and many, many camping bots. They are so obviously bots, yet, on another website, I see the owner was interviewed and vehemently denied the use of bots there to generate more traffic.

I think the only way we can put our point across to Linden Labs is to deluge them, and all the SL periodicals, with our opinions along with photographs and numbers of bots:real av ratios. Because, it seems there are more bots than real avs in Second Life currently, and that cannot be right can it?

If you're interested in bots and their use in distorting search results, you might enjoy the related video I posted on Youtube:

I have to ask... what is the journalistic justification for this article, or ones like it?

Admittedly, I don't play Second Life, but that in and of itself should say something: Second Life is a commercial product. There isn't a CNN-approved blog for Lost (or is there?), so this essentially equates to free publicity for this company.

Even if Second Life, as a growing media outlet, is relevant enough for inclussion on the CNN site, couldn't there at least be some style guidelines or news standards?

For example, what is a "bot." In traditional stories there should be a nut graph or something similar near the top to let readers who aren't deeply involved in the Second Lifestyle know what you are talking about. I imagine readers who already know what bots are will not find anything new in this article. The only hint I could find as to what a bot is was near the bottom of the entry.

Also, what about comments like these:

"These pictures were taken by me and a trusted friend." – Is there some relevance to his friend being "trusted," would I have reason to believe he would call someone he does not trust his friend?

"You can trust me, however, that I am telling the truth and reporting facts in this report. I have no reason to make up something that is not true." – What? Someone telling me I should just trust them makes me feel even less likely to do so, but I fail to see how an article (sorry, blog) about a technical mechanic in a consumer product should require trust.

What does it take to get recognized by CNN?

Those who aren't technically savvy enough to be in SL criticize. It's just that simple. Have you tried it?

And yes, most of us have jobs. I'm actually quite a successful professional. I even have a large amount of interaction with people from SL in real life. Other companies, like IBM use it as a platform for international meetings. It's a viable alternative to video conferencing.

As to what I've learned and improved as a person from SL, here's a quick 5:

1) I've furthered my business skills and management practices in a safe laboratory enviroment which allows you to take risks that you might not take in real life.

2) I've networked beyond that enviroment to the real world and now have real world business contacts I might not have had before.

3) I've met people from all across the world and learned about the diversity in world wide cultures.

4) I've learned more about photoshop and graphics creation and the application of them into video game like enviroments.

5) I've learned a new scripting language and how it inter-operates with other scripting languages.

All that and I still go outside on a very regular basis!

4-18-08 VOICE FROM THE DESERT

Before you vote
I think that the most crucial points that voters should consider before they vote in the remaining primaries are these: You were a major participant, by an “yes” vote, in making a trillion dollar mistake on your job. Would you go to your employer and ask for a promotion and a pay raise, as Senator Hillary Clinton is doing? And if you did, would you expect your boss, the voters, to grant your requests? In fact, what level of outrage could you expect from him/her, given the circumstances? If your employer granted your requests, what would it say about the performance standards at your place of employment?

Also, consider Hillary’s attitude about her misguided vote to race into Iraq. She did so without even bothering to read the IE for herself. One cannot get the intelligence wrong on such an important matter as attacking a sovereign country without provocation. When, where and with whom, did she raise these points? Didn’t our troops deserve better? What does this say about the sub par performance standards, which she sets for herself? Wouldn’t she demand higher standards, even from an intern? Isn’t this an example of elitism gone wild?

E. Monroe
Fallon, Nv
(775) 423-7251

Why do I care?

Unless they implement police, there should be no rules against bots or any other nefarious activities. The fact of the matter is, most people on SL want to use it as a place to be someone they aren't in real life. In some cases, someone they could never be in real life.

I roleplay online. If I'm on my avatar, I am being him. I lay my personality, ideas, morals, lifestyle, etc. at the "door". He happens to be a criminal. Now, I've never stolen anything, or done anything with bots, but I've done plenty against the rules. Now, if I was chased by cops and they caught me and put my avatar in jail; I'd be fine with that. But to have a god (administrator) locate me with omniscience and banish me with omnipotence...that destroys the illusion.

Those of us who run our businesses with honesty and integrity are appalled at the people who cheat with bots on their sims, and then tell us they're "the best" whatever.

While I understand the concept of paying people to camp (although I don't do that on my land – waste of my own money); and also having "models" for skins, etc.; I am unable to condone any other use for bots.

If you have put a thousand bots on your land just to boost traffic numbers, you are liars, cheaters, dishonest, disreputable, untrustworthy, and unworthy of both my time and my money.

I will not be visiting the above-named sims anytime soon, nor any of those of my so-called "friends" who have done the same thing. They have slapped me, as a fellow business owner, in the face with this awful practise, and my version of turning the other cheek is to completely separate myself from them.

IMHO I don't think bots should be allowed at all.

If designers need ways to model their wares, why not just create mannequins? It works for RL designers quite well. Bots artificially drive up numbers and can create several problems. I find it ridiculous that someone would spend so much time creating bots.

And for the comment about the Lindens not doing anything until it becomes a huge issue.. well, yes, thats true. They don't want to put the kabash on creativity or intellectual property issues unless and until it starts to adversely affect the general population. Their hands off approach (while sometimes frustrating) is actually a way of letting the population dictate what goes and what doesn't in-world.

If enough people complain and make something an issue, the Lindens will take a look at it.

@ Marigold Devin aka Tracey Sassoon

Platinum World does not use bots – the Coffee Shop is a camping area, always has been and always will be. All avatars on the sim are owned by other people. I don't have any alt accounts.

Happy for anyone to come to Platinum World and talk to any of the campers!

This is unlike Alady that have 20 – 30 bots boosting their traffic to rip off other hard working business owners.

I had considered logging my Pandora bot, which I have spent some time adding to, into a platform such as second life for the purpose of interaction in conversation, etc. The more they chat the more they "learn." I was wanting to do so without deception and simply to give her a chat platform. I thought this might be useful and WAS excited about seeing others creative endeavors in this regard.

It is indeed unfortunate that there are those who would abuse such tools and platforms to the point of ruining it for everyone. Of course we see this in the world community in almost every avenue and the result in both world and cyber communities is simply a waste of time and resources, the actions of a hand full of selfish individuals take away from everyone. I am so grateful to those who have given selflessly and worked hard for the advancement of humanity as a whole. I aspire to be one of them. Socrates said, "I wish I had infinite capacity for evil as it would endow infinite capacity for the good."

Those who cheat to get ahead end up cheating everyone, even themselves.

Errin N Davenport

Rebecca Vacano you have delusion disorder. Your SIM should never have got onto Popular Places listing. I (and others) have tried to talk to your 'campers' sitting out at the 'coffee shop' and rarely does anyone speak. Its a depressing bland area, and you have way too many camping chairs considering the ratio of campers to shoppers.
But its no matter now that Linden have decided to do away with the Popular Places list. Enough people have spoken out against the unfairness of allowing those corrupt enough to cheat the game, and a new way of calculating traffic has to be figured out.
As for me being "aka Tracey Sassoon" I kind of wish I was, but then I would not have time to respond to these forums.
People who use Second Life are not dimwits, and they soon do realise where the good places are to spend their time and their Linden dollars.
Your wrath at my words, and your lies about the number of bots used on Alady, mean nothing to the many happy customers who shop for skins on Alady.

I own a store called Aman on Alady island i rent the space and i have 6 campers which are probably who Rebecca is referring to or the 12 models I see in alady store have been there 3 years modeling skins and shapes.

Rebecca has been stalking Tracey in the Sellers guild till she got thrown out for harrassment of Tracey and other business owners telling the sellers guild (Rebecca vacano) "I make more money then any other business in SL – I have the best products and will put all of you out of business. You can ask anyone in sellers guild about this this.

Rebeccas camping area of 90 people are mostly bots camping for her to have an issue with any one else having bots is plain strange considering most of her camping area is bots. Seems she is upset that others are having bots camping in sl she must feel she should be the only one doing it.

She is well known in SL to stalk other business owners by making posts and has a well known odd sick obession with Alady and Tracey Sassoon that is well known.

You can go to search in places and type in A Lady and you will see she continues to pretend to have A Lady (not ALady) bodies in her store which she doesnt.

For her to post here about bots when she has almost 90 camping bots on her sim is rather odd

She usually posts anonymously though maybe she ran out of anonymous names to post under

@Shawnwirtz & Marigold – sorry I disagree, in fact here is a chat log between one of my friends and Tracey Sassoon about her bots.

In terms of sales and quality products – who else in Secondlife has to resort to selling their entire shop of hundreds of shapes and skins for L$4,000? That indicates a sign of desperation from Alady.

Enjoy reading the below which will show you exactly what Tracey Sassoon admits too with using bots.

[10:33] Mr X: Hi – How are you doing? I wondered if you had any comment about the bots you are using to artificially raise your traffic score, I am just about to publish an article on Alady with this respect on New World Notes. And will be publishing pictures and date logs etc. Anyway its only fair to give you the right to reply before I publish.
[10:37] Tracey Sassoon: I dont use bots to artificially raise traffic score i have a camping ball for that people stand by and camp. As far as the 6 models who model my body shapes they show samples of sizes and were never created for traffic they were created to show size samples of my work. You should pick on the places that have 20-80 bots that serve are not modeling creations of the creators. I have had model avies since my first store and no one has every complained.
[10:39] Tracey Sassoon: And i am not about to stop having models show my sizes in my store because customers appriciate seeing what they look like
[10:39] Mr X: ok this article is off the back of the places that use 20 – 80 bots and you have been identified as one of them. Sources tell me your traffic score has gone from 30K to nearly 60K a day over the past 3 months, do you have anything to say about that?
[10:41] Tracey Sassoon: yes my score has went up if you check because more people are coming to camp at the camping area and I put in dressing rooms on my 2nd floor which attrack a great deal of women daily the past few weeks by word of mouth a place they can come and change their clothing and avie in privacy if they dont have a place in sl to do so without being hit on my men that is why my stats went up because tons of women are stopping in to use the dressing rooms
[10:41] Tracey Sassoon: i have never had more than 6 models in my store that come and stand nothing more
[10:42] Mr X: what do you have to say about all the people at your camping area having the same group names in them?
[10:42] Tracey Sassoon: i dont hand out any group tags at my campnig area
[10:42] Tracey Sassoon: what does their tag say ?
[10:42] Mr X: SLResearch
[10:42] Tracey Sassoon: i stop in there every couple days i never see same tags i usually boot odd looking ones
[10:43] Tracey Sassoon: I have never seen sl research ?
[10:43] Mr X: That I put to you is a classic sign of them being bots
[10:43] Tracey Sassoon: if i see odd ones that have almost same name i boot them if i think they maybe someone logging in many of them
[10:43] Tracey Sassoon: i even have a couple campers IM me if they see too many same named similar ones i go and check and then boot them
[10:44] Mr X: ok well thank you for your time, we will put your side of the story for the article too
[10:44] Tracey Sassoon: i have never seen slresearch tags
[10:44] Tracey Sassoon: i dont use bots in my camping area
[10:45] Tracey Sassoon: make sure you put facts because I do have a lawyer
[10:45] Tracey Sassoon: i just looked and no one in camping has sl research tags
[10:46] Tracey Sassoon: and only one there looks like a ruth
[10:48] Mr X: Thanks – as I say we will put your side of the story in the article too – thanks for your time
[10:51] Mr X: oh nearly forgot – you may want to see our original article on New World Notes for the background and why we have widened the scope.
[10:51] Mr X: take care
[10:53] Tracey Sassoon: well there is no more than 6 avies i use for my store and I have 0 avies I use at the camping area for the record I would never and have never had my own camping bots in my camping area that is factual
[10:55] Mr X: Some people would class having 6 avies in your store as inflating traffic too – do you know that having 6 avies on your land for 24 hours is the equivalent of 10K of traffic? thats 10% of your traffic score.
[10:55] Mr X: as I say we have enough for the moment thanks
[10:56] Tracey Sassoon: well you can write me up for having 6 avies in my store they model my work here in sl
[10:56] Tracey Sassoon: if people get mad then they can model my work for free because I dont make enough money to pay people to model my work
[10:57] Tracey Sassoon: and I have had them since I opened my store I always have had 4-6 models
[10:57] Mr X: So you are admitting that you use bots (abilt 6 bots) for your own financial gain?
[10:57] Tracey Sassoon: that is how i grew my business because people can see my work
[10:57] Tracey Sassoon: yep 6 bots model my sizes of shapes so customers can see them real time
[10:57] Tracey Sassoon: my business wouldnt have grown unless people can see shape sizes in real time
[10:58] Mr X: and can I ask how you have 6 bots – LL cap the allowed number of alternative accounts at 5. Did you obtain them by deception?
[10:58] Tracey Sassoon: I create shapes so its hard for people to see the work
[10:58] Tracey Sassoon: no my son, nephew and next door neighbor log them in
[10:58] Mr X: oh I see
[10:58] Tracey Sassoon: they help me by logging in models for me
[10:59] Tracey Sassoon: on thier computers
[10:59] Mr X: so technically you could have 15 alts then?
[10:59] Tracey Sassoon: no each log in 2 avies
[11:00] Tracey Sassoon: they have their own account and 2 alts in exchange i pay their internet bills
[11:00] Mr X: ok thanks for your time – I appreciate your input
[11:00] Tracey Sassoon: np